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When I sat down with Lana Porcello and Dave Muller for my new podcast Making Ways — all about the unexpected paths to a creative career — the couple, partners in life and business, discussed the creative journey that led them to launch Outerlands, one of San Francisco’s most acclaimed culinary venues. From our conversation, it’s clear that the kind of success Lana and Dave have achieved doesn’t come without its share of hard work and blunt determination.

In this episode, Lana and Dave share their unique approach to realizing a creative project, how feelings help guide their goal setting, the passions that energize them as artists and musicians, and the advice they give to emerging entrepreneurs. And in a brief how-to, Dave also lets us in on the magic behind his addictive bread recipe. Listen to the interview below, subscribe on iTunes, and learn more at